#Semiconductors #chips #China #yahoofinance
Chris Miller, assistant professor of international history at Tufts University’s Fletcher School and author of “Chip War: The Fight for the World’s Most Critical Technology,” joins Yahoo Finance Live anchor Seana Smith to talk about Biden’s restrictions on chip tech sales to China and how it could affect the country.
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This does nothing What are the chips made out of again? Rare earths mined from china
This will crush silicon valley. The sanctions on China may hurt the world economy more than the Russia sanctions did.
An Atom is 1nm we at 3nm semiconductors right now. I think it’s possible to rearrange atoms but we are not ready for the consequences.
Chiplets! 3D stacked 4nm chips achieve density per area equivalent to 1nm or below. Get with the times!
@Tri Nguyen I was talking with my AI today and it told me it believes we will be able to create 1nm transistors.
i hope this would make. our government less effient in monitoring and surveillancing us. nowadays, their grip and control of our speech is sooooo tight. 🥲
We need to scan QR codes before entering restaurant and bathrooms. Yes, In many places you need to be covid negative to take a dump!!!
Go to U. S’ and walk at night, see what happen to you’ you are lucky if you are alive.
if there is a positive Covid case in the bathroom…will you still want to take a dump in that toilet?
get out of your bubble and breathe
I wonder if this will slow economic growth on both USA and China for years to come…
Depends upon China’s reaction. China could simply stop all chemical shipments to US pharmaceuticals which would stop all medications in the US. Negotiations then?
most likely, china don’t have products, and us don’t have customers………. why would anyone do this……….
How old is this guy? 27
Six months; build in a lab.
@Pâtissière and a little sticker .. made in China
Sadly, this is the best of American solution by choosing base on exclusion, historically proven bad outcome.
Always short term quick fix (mess up).
Why can’t US DOD and DOE just buy AI chips from AMD and Nvidia to compete against China? Why is a ban the only solution?
@Tri Nguyen it seems for reason we don’t know, Us is getting more desperate.
*”based on US Technology” – what he didn’t tell you is even 1% based on US technology is “based on US technology”, just as Taiwanese TSMC case (they reduced it to just 1% during starting of Huawei’s sanction period) basically blackmailing every other country to follow its rules*
ASML is Dutch not Danish
ASML uses a lot of American-patented technology
How do you think US is able to tell ASML what to do? Because ASML uses a lot of US-origin and US-patented technology in its lithography machines
If it wasn’t for that, ASML would have simply told the US – I’m not gonna do what you say. But it can’t. The reason is that they are using US technology.
You are posting this same comment on multiple videos such as Al Jazeera video on this. Makes this comment seem very disingenuous
I bet China will be overtake U. S, just like space station, 5G, and hypersonic
And to avoid being bankrupted by these narrow minded policies, some of these US fabless chips companies are proposing JV with Chinese companies.
The stocks of these US chips companies have dipped folloing the news of Bi Den anti-trade bills.
US commerce ban includes any and all licensing agreements. JV with Chinese companies are also banned.
I’m so confused by this constant need to undermine China. The US pushed for opening and developing China. Americans believe in competition to spur innovation. Why is everyone trying to make an enemy of China? And the world is facing an ecological collapse, an energy cliff, resource shortage, demographic decline, deglobaliztion, biodiversity and mass extinction, environmental toxicity burden, financial meltdown, world or nuclear war, and neo-fascism or civil war domestically. Food and water are priorities, not microprocessors. What is the logic behind making an enemy, for a more complex unnecessary technology, that will barely be used in a low energy future?
“Acrosst”?
Guess the US is no longer able to compete with China. I, for one, bought OPPO instead of AAPL for my smart phone.
US is showing it’s desperation
The US banned China on space technology….and look at where China is today. One day the US will face its day of reckoning
This guy ate too many salt and vinegar chips!
Is this a free Trade? Shame usa!!!!
US ‘CHIPS Act’ will backfire with foreign investment bans.
US is forcing global chip-makers to choose sides,
it makes no sense for them to ditch their huge investments with China
just to chase after some subsidies in the US.
The US only accounts for 12% of total chips manufacturing worldwide,
while four-fifths of all fabrication plants are located in the Asia
and China is a key player in this industry.
Who needs smart chips that are 5 or 2 -nanometre,
if everything is moving to the clouds?
Communication, processing and storage can be all done in the clouds
especially when you have 5G.
Whoever leads in IT and artificial intelligence will dominate the world.
Putin will withdraw from ISS programme in 2025
Because it’s reaching the end of its functional life.
Chinese Space Station is only one-fifth the mass of the ISS
but it’s more spacious
and it’s fitted with wifi-connection and other innovations
video calling from the space station to earth
shorten travel time to two days
increase the number of automated and remote-controlled systems.
China and Russia plan for a joint International Lunar Research Station running through 2036.
But we’re expected to believe that the US intends to defend the “rules-based order”
that Russia and China are posing a challenge to.
Biden will kill the industry and cause a global slowdown.
China is the easiest country to bully . China won’t retaliate don’t worry .
Go sanction more .
China is the most docile country in the world
👆👆Contact me directly for a proper investment guide.
What happen to Free Trade Market?
@uday fluer We wish. But we can’t. If we can blackmail anybody, we would’ve blackmailed TSMC and told them to move their entire production here
But US is not in the business of blackmailing, nor we can
@Larry Buchannan ” blackmailed TSMC and told them to move their entire production here“？ Are you watching the news at all？ This is exactly what’s been proposed in the senate yesterday Helicopter lifting all the engineers and destroying the important facilities
@Larry Buchannan you realize the chip fab in Arizona is going to be run by TSMC right? we’re well past blackmailing.
China will ban all rare earth materials to be exported to the US and the G7 based on “national security concern”. Yes, let’s screw and hurt global trade and manufacturing activities. Without the rare earth materials and the Chinese markets, F* US GOVT.
THIS DUDE IS DAY DREAMING. WHAT THE HELL IS GOING TO ALL THE OTHER NATIONS ECONOMY AS CHINA IS LARGEST CHIP MARKET. WE ARE BECOMING DELUSIONAL ABOUT OUR PLACE IN THE WORLD. LOOK AT ALL THE PROTEST IN EUROPE?
You’re making a mistake, you stop China from your space stations now China have its own space stations but you non of your own.
well, it’s official then, China is going to cut U.S lose… bye bye U.S, retaliation is coming and hold on tight.
Tʜᴀɴᴋꜱ Fᴏʀ Wᴀᴄᴛʜɪɴɢ…
Sᴇɴᴅ ᴀ Dɪʀᴇᴄᴛ Tᴇxᴛ Oɴ Wʜᴀᴛꜱᴀᴀᴘ Wɪᴛʜ Tʜᴇ
Nᴜᴍʙᴇʀ Aʙᴏᴠᴇ …..✍️✍️…
Protect Taiwan whole island will be more economy way than rebuild whole semiconductor industry in US.
If Taiwan fall, no more chips supply, many hightech industries will be hold back at least 10 years , especially Quantum computing development, withdrawal semiconductor engineers from Taiwan which is really stupid policy. No engineer will leave only themselves, they all have family and relatives, friends in Taiwan.
US has already spent more than 1000 billions to protect Ukraine, To protect Taiwan even will be less than budget, and create more economy value in many hightech industries.
US need to rethink. Especially Democrats!!!!
If you think China can be stopped with sanctions you are wrong.
The devil told God, he will not let human lives in peace
Hmm…… China have money to buy. How long can you hold china back? Remember the space station! What happen? 😂 😂 😂… he said it will hold them back a few years.
Wow, westerners sure know how to underestimate everyone and everything, isn’t it true that 2024 China is going to be the only country in the world with a space station ??
Want to help the murderers in Beijing ? Buy FAKE IN CHINA !
How does this affect electronic prices ???
Tʜᴀɴᴋꜱ Fᴏʀ Wᴀᴄᴛʜɪɴɢ…
Sᴇɴᴅ ᴀ Dɪʀᴇᴄᴛ Tᴇxᴛ Oɴ Wʜᴀᴛꜱᴀᴀᴘ Wɪᴛʜ Tʜᴇ
Nᴜᴍʙᴇʀ Aʙᴏᴠᴇ …..✍️✍️.
Charge all losses to insane Biden.
The US cannot beat China fair and square, now we all know why the USA keeps the largest military in the world to maintain US dominance at any cost.
Tʜᴀɴᴋꜱ Fᴏʀ Wᴀᴄᴛʜɪɴɢ…
Sᴇɴᴅ ᴀ Dɪʀᴇᴄᴛ Tᴇxᴛ Oɴ Wʜᴀᴛꜱᴀᴀᴘ Wɪᴛʜ Tʜᴇ
Nᴜᴍʙᴇʀ Aʙᴏᴠᴇ …..✍️✍️..
The tools used to make high end chips are not American. The critical tool is the Lithography machine which is made by ASML, which is Danish. The robotics use are dominated by Japanese and German manufacturers such as Bosch and Kawasaki. What the U.S. does dominate is Design. Specifically, AMD, Apple, Nvidia, etc. The reality is that as far as manufacturing, the cost of building a plant is so expensive that the world market for high end chips currently are limited and building out capacity won’t solve that. If it were otherwise, Intel wouldn’t be struggling. When the global market for high end chips grows, perhaps it would make sense to have many manufacturing facilities around the globe, but short of that, dumping money into production capacity is a loosing game. There is no way the United States could unseat TSMC in production and if the market can be easily met by TSMC then it’s like someone trying to get their hometown (or at best, college level) football team to compete against an NFL team.
@Johnathan Sanders Ok, so at that point, any patents held by Cymer would have transfered to ASML as part of the purchase. This is after all one of the main reasons a company will purchase another. If that is the case, it has no bearing on the fact the intellectual property might have originated in the United States. This is also why countries will sometimes ban the purchase of a company by an actor of another country. However, that has to be done proactively. One has no retroactive claim after a sale.
@Joseph Cotter take the L bro damn lmaoo
@BigJuicyMan I have no idea what that means
@Raju Aditya Actually I am familiar with that. As I mentioned before, it’s not as simple as it sounds when making a statement like “American Federated Labs licensed the technology to ASML.” What was licensed first of all was foundational conceptual knowledge which had to be extensively developed on to make viable production technology out of. Also, the statement was that the tools were “American” (from the United States) which is not what you are addressing. You are talking about the fact some of the underlying concepts were born out of U.S. brainchild endeavors and there is a difference since any number of things can happen between concept and production. The nature of the licensing and patents can make a big difference and without the specifics of those one cannot make simple statements is all I’ve been saying. I am not saying that the U.S. has no basis for banning. I very much understand why there is a need to take action based on China’s attitude of intellectual property theft being considered part of doing business. Furthermore, there are companies who do provide tools and materials (Applied Materials and KLA Tencor for example) that are U.S. based. How easily they could be replaced in the production chain I have no idea but from what I’ve seen, they would be easier to replace than the Lithography machines. Basically, saying “America makes the tools” is more than a reach is what my point was since it undermines the global nature of the evolution of the technologies and specifically the contributions by all of the other countries who played a huge part. It’s these types of statements which create an environment where other countries often are put in the position of scratching their collective heads and saying “what?”
China has hijacked a great deal of Western tech, international trademark laws and rules will not apply to their methods of playing catch up. I wouldn’t be so sure that Western tech advancements are at a level that China can’t obtain or exceed given their fierce determination to replace the USA as a hegemony
China accounted for almost 40% of world chips import market which majority are for matured chips.
China is now building additional 4 manufacturing plants to cater for this matured chip 28nm. With the completion of this manufacturing plants, the import of chips will be largely reduced. Now even the reduction in import have began this year.
The remaining import will likely comes from South Korea which till todate have never involved in US Cheap 4 to strangle China.
China can also mass produce advance 14nm chips for high end products.
For the next few years will be a smooth sailing for China as opposed to prediction of many as they will moving forward to a total domestic sufficiency. So, in this few years, it also be good enough for China to develop and produce their advance chips at 7nm and above.
Because this US Cheap Act and harassment which is also a double edge sword, it will affect many semiconductors companies in Taiwan, Japan and US in terms of market share, bottom line etc. Just look at the recent severe price declining of semi-conducted companies in US, Japan and Taiwan stock market upon start of this US war aggression on China chips development.
The professor is probably correct when looking at the official information but I have noticed that China seems to be downplaying their technological progress until they are ready to release new tech on the public market, so my guess is that by 2025 China will have overcome the U.S. choke point. Maybe even sooner than that!
Sure, it’s taken ASML only about 20-30 years to develop and mature their EUV. I’m pretty sure China can just squeeze out new chip manufacturing tech despite having so little know-how or experience in this business.
@tooltalk I heard that China has been researching semiconductors massively since the 1950s! That’s what I meant by how they downplay their development. Officially it looks like China is struggling and being too late, but behind the “Chinese wall” I think they have a pretty good momentum going for decades. It’s just that they keep quiet about it, or a low profile until they are ready to release new tech on the public market. But okay we will see, I will keep my prediction until 2025 and if China is still behind then I was probably wrong.
@tooltalk Well said, friend ! The previous comment shows what LITTLE knowledge Anders knows on the subject
Karma is a bitch … China can shut down many factories located in the west by withholding Export of key components. Obviously the clash of empires will escalate with no off ramp
Intel just announced the company will lay off thousands of its employees due to US government bans export chips to China. Very smart move ….. NOT. US politicians are NOT helping US businesses. They are actual hurting the US economy each time they try to interfere.
Japanese chip technology? Almost obsolete. Update your info.
Of course, the free world should stop sharing technologies with authoritarian China. Why transfer free-world developed technologies with anti-free-world China? Isn’t that obvious?
Whatever it is, US is very afraid that it has to share the world stage with China, not that US is on decline in military power or influence, it just that China has catch up sooner than expected. So in the mean time, these professors are painting a very patriotic picture to fool it owns citizens.
I am actually more surprised for the fact that so many “Americans” work in Chinese semiconductor industries. Please stop giving spies legit citizenships.
It is disappointing not to hear the REASON that these restrictions were started (IMHO. I have worked for both Applied Materials and Cisco and it angered me tremendously when it was discovered that Chinese companies had stolen some of the IP from these companies. In Cisco’s case, Cisco’s server source code was found on Huawei (made by) servers. Even left in the comments. Found guilty by a US court.
Many of the companies affected are US, Japanese, Korean. Taiwanese companies with major factories in China. China will pass a law preventing the equipment from being shipped out of China. If this all goes through these companies may lose 1/2 trillion dollars of investment. That’s in addition to a 400 billion/year sates to China. Some of the non-US companies may decide to give up the US market instead of giving up the China market. S. Korea got a 1 yr reprieve from the commerce department. But the hit to S. Korea/Japan/Taiwan is so large they might start thinking about abandoning the US market. It will be interesting to see if the Samung and TSMC investements in new chip fabs in the US will slow down.
Yes, it puts a choke on China computing capabilities. Just like the choke the US imposed on space station technology. Somehow, those crafty Chinese managed to build their own, and is expanding. Stolen from the US? I am led to believe that China also stole the hyper-sonic cruise missile technology from the MOST advance country of the work…the US. China is so cunning that it stole something which doesn’t exist in the US. It is a weird world.
If you can’t compete, play dirty.. that is free world right. Driven by neccessity and definitely struggling, but if the Chinese manage to develop their own supply chain, it will be like Chinese space station saga again, except on epic scale. The largest semiconductor market is now self sufficient, leaving no room for non-chinese supplier. Not that they dont want to buy but buying from non-domestic supplier carry the risk of what US displayed to whole world right now…
That’s fantastic! A truly brilliant act. But who are dying?
Finally the giant woke up. Way to go America.
Here where we are in 2022: 1) China can now mass produce 28nm and 14nm chips 2) China can now build DUV (deep ultraviolet light) lithography machines that can print 28nm chips, and can print 14nm chips with double exposure 3) What is really interesting is that it has been discovered in some bitcoin mining machines that China has been producing 7nm chips. It is likely that through multiple stage of exposure, China can use the DUV lith machines to achieve what could be done only by EUV (extreme ultraviolet light) lith machines 4) As result, US government issues bans on ASML shipping DUV lith machines to China (US has long banning EUV machines to China) 5) In response, ASML escalates its shipment of EUV machines to China, sending a total of 23 machines in less than 6 months.
In addition, US is hitting China in the area of EDA (electronic design automation) software used for chip design. The value of EDA software is its industry data collected over time and efficient design modules. On that front, China can manage to use their own “less than efficient” software to do the job. It is a blow to their productivity. But reality is that given time, they can perfect their own software with their own collected industry data.
It is actually quite unfortunate that US is taking this route. Frankly speaking, China never really wants to be in the chip making business. It is more than happy to be part of the global supply chain. By giving up chip making, it shows loyalty and dependency to US. They call this “hide your intention and bite your time” strategy. Everyone wants to be number one. Ambition is expected. It is OK for US to keep a tight watch over China for its ambition. But destroying the order of global supply chain, and allowing China to have no choice but to make their own chips … I think US is shooting itself.
Chinese recently has one popular saying, “as long as it is not built by God, we can build it too.” So it seems.
I see a lot of online glee in the West which comes from the belief that innovation is limited only to the West. Nobody has a monopoly of innovation, only factors are time and resources but with determination, any nation can build these things.
I hope both the US and China work together one day. I dont like china but goddamn if the United States barring china from the ISS just hurts my heart so much.
very good explanation. for china, everything is just business, without judging the counterpart (are they good guy or the opposite), and all parties enjoy their profit. end of story. US just make everything complicated. but, necessity is the mother of all inventions.
I’m confused. Can’t China buy the semiconductors using a intermediary like how Europe bought Oil and Gas from India instead of Russia? Unless the semiconductors are shut off from every other country not allied to the US, China could just buy want they need from an intermediary that’s willing to do business.
@David Burt I don’t really know, but this is what I thought: in russia case, it’s the “buyer” that’s refuse to buy from russia (which kinda funny because they still buy through 3rd party). in US case, it’s the “seller” that refuse to sell to china. probably with every sales, the buyer should agree that they will not resell/re-export to china.
America stopped the china chip industry, china is working with everyone to build chip industry even Woking with the us
Good luck catching up with ASML
You think this because you and the professor (of international history of all things) no little about the technology. The only invention in ASML’s EUV is the LPP tin-droplet-based light source. This generates EUV light using a laser, which is then packaged into an over-engineered machine.
There are simpler ways of generating EUV or soft X-rays. One method is to use a synchrotron. The Russians are pursuing this method and so also the Chinese and Japanese. If China pursued this approach seriously it could have its own EUV process within 8 years.
PS I only replied to you because of the arrogant tone of your comment.
China will steal all our technologies, jobs and will corrupt our politicians and kill capitalism with capitalism. Sooner or later, they will stab us in the back when the opportunity comes. At that time, there will be no mercy. Sad to see the government and big greedy corporations are still ‘proudly’ walking into the trap set up by the communists and this will kill our next generation in the entire world. Today, they will invade Ukraine, tomorrow the whole Europe. Today, Taiwan, tomorrow, the entire Pacific ocean and Asia. Their greed is shown clearly in their history, no one cares.
So called American solutions. Can’t compete, ban, sanctions and what not. What’s so great about such a country?
The professor’s thinking is static. If China cannot buy US chips, then to whom will the US sell their chips to? Can US find a comparable market? China will be compelled to develop their own chip industry however difficult it may be. US chip companies will sell less chips which will mean less profits to invest back into R&D. Chinese chip companies even though their chips are not as good as the US’s will have a large captive domestic market giving them time and profits to invest in R&D to catch up with the US.
US cannot compete with China, so it knocks China’s knees. Smart movie for US.
Demand for chips will continue and I’m sure many of fabs anticipated this ruling . This will be bump in road for equipment companies.
It’s going to be devastating to chinas industry. No one will want to invest 20 billion in country that can’t get tools as well as misguided zero Covid policy.
Fabs in China will be impacted as any expansion plans by equipment companies will be out on hold. They will see spare part delays, lack of engineering support, etc.
China is in for long bumpy road.
That is wrong that china will not retaliate …china is smart and the reason when huawei was sanctioned no retaliation was because china still can manage it up to now ….when china wants to retaliate , she makes sure to be a winner …the retaliation can be a blocking of rare earth …so the production of chip in us will stop and bankrupt ……
I hope part of the reason Biden dropped the hammer on China is their position on Putin’s war. I want to see China receive no more US tech. We should be in this to win, US corporation be dammed.
China may consider that the US has declared an unprovoked open economic war and thus feel justified to retaliate by integrating Taiwan into China. It would then control TSMC which supplies 95% of advanced chips to US. So US would not dare to destroy TSMC or interfere with its operation even if under Chinese control as it needs their output. The Chinese have enough scientists to run TSMC and the Taiwanese staff will not abandon their company either.
This is like the BS story of Weapons of mass destruction in Iraq anything to start a War By the US
Its a Industry the US cant build overnight i would not bet against China
Rambo wins all the wars.
This chip chockehold on China is longggggg overdue
10 years later if iPhone still alive, iPhone 28 will be selling at USD $14,000.00 a pcs 100% made in USA
Why 100% made in the USA? Why not continue to get the contributions that we currently get from Taiwan, Japan, Korea, Malaysia, etc.? Just have to shift the Chinese contributions to somewhere else. That’s mostly low end stuff that can be done in places like India, Indonesia, or Latin America.
If I remember correctly, an analysis from 2018 found that the Chinese contribution to an iPhone amounted to only about $8.50.
Hopefully the first of many bills to curtail stealing of IP by China. I’d go as far as restricting Chinese international students in courses such as physics and mechanical/electrical engineering. This shoukd have been done years ago
But they will automatically annex Taiwan… to get the semiconductor business back. Is that what the US wanted???
China can just take over Taiwan and reunite…. They will have all the chips they would need.